Linux Audio

[Heinz]

I decided to desert from Micro$oft years ago and started using Linux exclusively. I know many excellent software packages like Firefox, OpenOffice or MPlayer that help me with my daily work but I have only recently discovered that Linux really shines when it comes to multimedia.

There is a great variety of software packages that have evolved around "Jack" (kind of a virtual patch panel, that lets you transport sound from one app to the next). See http://jackaudio.org/applications for details and a an elaborate list of software. Many of these applications can be used as real-time effect processors and have excellent quality. Guitarix is my favorite. Ardour is a powerful recording and sequencing software that has more functions than I'll ever need (or even know of).

And keep in mind: they are free.

If you're interested in playing with Linux audio software the following distributions may be a good starting point. They all have Live DVDs that boot the system without installation. You can run and test these without modifying your PC:

http://www.bandshed.net/AVLinux.html
http://www.apodio.org/
http://www.artistx.org/site2/
http://www.musix.org.ar/en/index.html

Ubuntu Studio is a very good distribution if you decide to install Linux to your harddisk:

http://ubuntustudio.org/

[simonallaway]

I remember looking into this probably 5 years ago and was impressed too. But has anyone solved the plugin problem yet? i.e. the ability to use VST/CoreAudio plugins in something like Ardour?

[Heinz]

There is a way to compile Ardour with VST support but the pre-compiled packages normally do not have it, since it requires parts of the (non-free) Steinberg SDK. A simpler solution is "fst" that uses wine and the Steinberg SDK and registers a single VST plugin in Jack for each instance that is running. This works better than it may sound.

[Bassmanster]

All my recordings of the last year have been made on vanilla Ubuntu with the Studio audio package.  Jack, Ardour, Hydrogen.  On a Dell Inspiron 530N.

In fact there is a thread here somewhere...

I don't use many plugins.  Maybe compression and reverb.  High pass filter.

[Bassmanster]

http://www.el34world.com/Forum/index.php?topic=6663.0

[Heinz]

Sorry I didn't mention that thread. That's what got me into Jack in the first place.

I wanted to highlight the possibility to try these packages with Live DVDs that boot up a pre-configured and working Linux environment without messing up your existing OS.

[Bassmanster]

Right.  For those who are interested you download the live CD or DVD (usually overnight) and then burn it to a disk.  You then boot from that disk.  You can preview the OS "live" from the disk w/o touching your hard drive, among other things.  If you wish to install, you can usually do so from that live preview too.  After the install, there will usually be a significant number of updates to download on the current version.  You can also get all your free software of interest (using the package manager), proprietary drivers if available, and arrange things to your liking.

[simonallaway]

I second that. The LiveCD also gives you the chance to see if your basic hardware (video card, network, sound card etc) is actually supported. You can go from "zero" to "oh, this actually works really well" in a few minutes.

To support by embryonic tube amp habit I work as a programmer, and Linux is my development environment...has been for years now. I cannot recommend it enough as a stable and trustworthy tool.

[Madison]

All I can say is WOW!

I downloaded the Ubuntu 9.1 and tried it on my Macbook for the past 24 hours.
This was just running off the CD!
From clicking download to up and running in 20 minutes.
When I see all that is happening in the Linux community I feel like I have been sort of boxed in with OSX.
I really wish I didn't have so much time and money tied up in the OSX, I'd probably switch.
For the price........who wouldn't?
Certainly is appealing.

I am playing around with Hydrogen 2 on OSX now, just to see.

I'd really like to try Ardour and see how is stack up against Logic Express.

Also wondering how Open Office handles daily tasks.

BTW, thanks for all the info everyone and the links Bassmanster!

[Heinz]

I guess you found it out already...Ardour is available for Mac, as well. See http://ardour.org/

[Madison]

Yes, found that.
Will try to get this machine to dual boot with Linux.
Want to see how Ardour, Jack, etc  perform under the Ubuntu; provides more audio routing/sync options.
Thanks

[Bassmanster]

Enjoy!  The package manager is a gateway to mucho free stuff.

[Bassmanster]

Oh, now that I think of it, there was one problem trying to dual boot with my old iMac.  The OSX partition was big and we couldn't find any way to compress it.  It didn't leave much room for an Ubuntu partition.  Hopefully you won't have that prollem.

Another thing you can consider is scrounging up a not-so-new PC.  Just throw Windows away.  Linux runs a lot better and lighter than MSW on an older slower machine.  You could even run XFCE as as your desktop (Xubuntu) on really slow old machines as it's the super light desktop.

[Madison]

Gave up on the dual boot with the OSX.
Too much hassle/way over my head.
Too bad.
I really was hoping I could external boot.
I had another 80 gig drive that I put Ubuntu on with the Macbook and it worked fine but don't feel like swapping internal drives all the time.

Tried Virtual Box a little but I don't have the power to really run it.

>>You could even run XFCE as as your desktop (Xubuntu) on really slow old machines as it's the super light desktop.

Exactly what I am doing right now with a dusty old workhorse P2 just to get some playtime.(fingers crossed it will run)
Might have to build a decent box eventually.

Thank you.

[Gman]

Right.  For those who are interested you download the live CD or DVD (usually overnight) and then burn it to a disk.  You then boot from that disk.  You can preview the OS "live" from the disk w/o touching your hard drive, among other things.  If you wish to install, you can usually do so from that live preview too.  After the install, there will usually be a significant number of updates to download on the current version.  You can also get all your free software of interest (using the package manager), proprietary drivers if available, and arrange things to your liking.

I use several flavors of Linux on different machines but still record under Win2KPro (Mixcraft).  Anyone tried recording using Ubuntu Studio Live CD?  Do all the toys (Ardour, etc.) work correctly right out of the box off the live CD?  I've been interested in Ardour (as well as Ubuntu Studio) and may have to give it a try.

(And Hey EL34 - Good to "see" ya again.)

[simonallaway]

I'd be interested in opinions on how Ardour compares with Logic Express for everyday multitrack recording/mixing. I have no issue with using either OS (I live in Linux at work, use Mac at home) and I might even try Ardour on my mac....that'll be interesting.

I guess when you get past usability issues it comes down to hardware support.

[Bassmanster]

I've only pulled Ardour over after the install.  I just get the whole Studio audio package.

I dunno how it compares to anything except Garage Band.  Beats the heck out of that.  Seems like you can do tons of stuff, but no decent doc, so I've just learned it as I went.  I plan to stick with it forever.  I don't do tons of tracks or effects but I WAS looking for good sound quality (48 @ 24bits) and latency compensation (low level controls over the audio buffers in Jack).  I just monitor the source.

I use an m-audio delta 44 sound card which is serving me pretty well too.  Open source drivers and control panel.

[jhadhar65]

>...a dusty old workhorse P2...

You might consider DSL, then:

http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/

It's a little more work than Xubuntu, but it'll run your P2 better.  I don't really like Xubuntu on anything less than a late model P3 or equivalent.  P4's with 256MB of RAM kicks it right on down the line.  I'm still exploring the whole Ubuntu world.  SUSE and Fedora are my favorites overall and I'm just getting into Slackware.  I just don't have the reading time available or I'd have stepped into Gentoo by now.  Maybe when I retire...

Any audio program is going to be memory intensive, though.  Get a box you can load with a gig or two of RAM and a speedy SATA.  A gig and a half processor is as low as I'd go if I were serious about it.  Machines are cheap.  They're even cheaper at your local electronics recycling dump.  They trash perfectly good Linux projects down there every day with specs much better than I'm suggesting.  I know this because I grab them from there, Linux-ize them, and give them away routinely.

[Gman]

DSL was always a little too small for me.  Not complete.  For small a small (~100 MB) but complete distro on older hardware I really like Puppy Linux-

http://www.puppylinux.org/

[Madison]

I'd be interested in opinions on how Ardour compares with Logic Express for everyday multitrack recording/mixing. I have no issue with using either OS (I live in Linux at work, use Mac at home) and I might even try Ardour on my mac....that'll be interesting.

I guess when you get past usability issues it comes down to hardware support.

I like Ardor but it really doesn't fit my personal needs.
I mean, if you were going to record a band live or put down a couple of track for ideas I think Ardor is great and a step up from Garage Band.Garage Band is a really good program too.

On the other hand I do a lot of midi implementation, sampling, loop cut/editing, composing?,whatever I can get my hands and head around.
Plus the guitar amps simulators in Logic Express are very good.
(I have Guitar Rig too)
IMHO since Logic Express 8 they have really streamlined and simplified the work flow which was badly needed.
So, Logic Express sort of does everything I need, plus.
It is well worth the $199 to get 'er done.

Don't get me wrong, I really like the Linux idea and think it is Ardor super.
I think they get all the former music software writers from the big guys to contribute anyway?
So, I'd anticipate Ardor and Linux will likely catch up, be equaled to, or surpass most pro/semi pro music software on the market in the next few years.(fingers crossed)
About the time I'll be ready to do another upgrade because I get sick of thinking about the OS favor of the week coming out that cost$
I'd prefer to boot up .... and do what I like.

My long-winded .oo2 assessment

>...a dusty old workhorse P2...

You might consider DSL, then:

http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/

It's a little more work than Xubuntu, but it'll run your P2 better.  I don't really like Xubuntu on anything less than a late model P3 or equivalent.  P4's with 256MB of RAM kicks it right on down the line.  I'm still exploring the whole Ubuntu world.  SUSE and Fedora are my favorites overall and I'm just getting into Slackware.  I just don't have the reading time available or I'd have stepped into Gentoo by now.  Maybe when I retire...

Yeah, I loaded up XUbuntu on the p2.
It "works" just not all that well.
I'll look at other variants.

I have a Palm E2 that I still use all the time.
I see that Linux and palm are friendly?
It would be fun to run Linux on it sometime if possible.
But, same here on the time constraints.

I liked playing around with Virtualbox running Ubuntu on my Mac but that machine really doesn't have enough RAM to support it.
Kind of an odd feeling running another OS on the desktop.

[jhadhar65]

SUSE Studio is a nifty idea:  susestudio.com

Me and my guys use the crap out of virtual environments and virtualbox is my personal toy of choice, but it's always going to be a 'sample'.  The machine I'm using right now runs 4GB of DDR2 with extended addressing and it still won't let a Linux guest run free.  Just the nature of the beast.  Multi-booting is a better option to get the most out of your OS choices.

Make yourself a disk image first...  I like Clonezilla for that.

Tungsten Android?  32MB might not be enough internal memory.  You'd have to research it.  There's a live cd out now though:  http://code.google.com/p/live-android/

[Bassmanster]

Palm Web OS is Linux, but beyond that I know nothing.

I'm waiting to see what transpires with the upcoming Dell and HP tablets/slates.  The Dell's gonna run Android.

Dunno how folks are getting along running Rosegarden (the sequencer), Hydrogen and Ardour together, but if I find out I'll post something.  There is an awesome looking synth emulator called Bristol (for some reason Bristol UK is some kind of synth ground zero...I have a friend from there) but I haven't tried it out.

[simonallaway]

Madison,
Thanks for your insights on Logic and Ardour. Your opinions are basically the same as mine...that Logic Express is a good all-rounder, especially for its price.

Over the years i've played with a few different brands of DAW software...Cubase, Sonar etc. (I never did get my hands on Protools) but I must say I was discouraged by Apple's entry with Garageband. It wasn't until I installed a trial of Logic Express that I found something I felt worked the same way my brain does.

Simon

[Bassmanster]

Glad to hear that about Logic.

I was gonna upgrade my Mac, but realized I could get into Linux for way less money.  So then I wasted it on a Hamptone preamp!   

I figured once I got through the learning curve I would be set.  No more yearly upgrade tax.

Yup.

[jhadhar65]

>I was gonna upgrade my Mac, but realized I could get into Linux for way less money.

Linux is everything Mac and MS keep promising the power users out there, but consistently failing to deliver.  Cost is irrelevant in that context.  Ballmer and Jobs have been so busy peeing on each others snowcones, they failed to notice Torvalds and Stallman blowing their doors off.  Market share, smarket share... real power comes from penguins.

Oh, and don't eat any yellow snowcones.